ND filter follow up (sorry)

"michel" <medgarevers.RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:bb334b60.0501300659.3c4ccd5@posting.google.com...
 > Thanks guys, I don't know why, I'm unable to answer
 > directly under my thread. Must be mozilla ? Anyway...
 >
 > Ok, I didn't know for the plain ND filter keeping the
 > same problem. So the split ND filter will be bought. I
 > saw in one Fitzharris book that to avoid vignetting, he
 > use duct tape to hold in place his split ND filter. Anyone
 > would recommend that if I stacked only 2 filters?. I
 > use a 72 mm dia lens. Anymodel of split ND filter
 > superior to other someone can recommend?

The Cokin ones are the cheapest, but not everyone (me included) feels that
they're totally neutral in colour - I think there's a slight magenta tint.
Of course, not everyone minds that.

HiTech are also fairly cheap, and I think are better than the Cokin ND
grad.s.

Singh Ray and Lee are the best. No doubt. But, of course, they are alos
the most expensive.


 > Also, i think > I'll take a medium one (force 2) ND. Any
 > advice on that too ?
 >

I probably use a 2 stop more than a one or a three, but I'd like to get
myself a 1 1/2 stop, as that would be very handy too. In the mountains a 2
or a 3 would probably be most useful. Remember that you can stack them, so
a one and a two could be stacked to give you a three, in need.


Peter<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: ND filter follow up (sorry) 

michel wrote:

 > Also, i think I'll take a medium one (force 2)
 > ND. Any advice on that too ?

I bought the HiTech 1, 2 and 3 stop hard & soft split
ND filter sets and a Cokin filter holder system last year.
In my experience a tripod is essential when using split
ND's, especially with 3 stop and hard split filters since
careful aligning is crucial for good results. I agree
that a lot of practice is required before one can expect
to master the use of split filters - I'm not even close
yet. :/

--
Ola<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: ND filter follow up (sorry) 

"michel" <medgarevers DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:bb334b60.0501300659.3c4ccd5@posting.google.com...
 > Thanks guys, I don't know why, I'm unable to answer directly under my
 > thread. Must be mozilla ? Anyway...
 >
 > Ok, I didn't know for the plain ND filter keeping the same problem. So
 > the split ND filter will be bought. I saw in one Fitzharris book that
 > to avoid vignetting, he use duct tape to hold in place his split ND
 > filter. Anyone would recommend that if I stacked only 2 filters?. I
 > use a 72 mm dia lens. Anymodel of split ND filter superior to other
 > someone can recommend? Also, i think I'll take a medium one (force 2)
 > ND. Any advice on that too ?
 >
 > Thank you, you're very helpful.
 >
 > Michel

REPOST FROM: "Newbie ask using ND filter with polarizer"
"michel" <medgarevers DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:bb334b60.0501311802.52d2d27d@posting.google.com...
 > Sorry again, I have to create a new thread with the same subject, I
 > put the same subject so I hope it will go under the same title
 > thread...
 >
 > Ok,
 > Me : Thank you for the info about the tripod. Let me know (and others
 > too) is it really necessary for using a split ND filter or I can just
 > do it with the camera hand held ? I can mount the camera on my
 > shoulder stock also, but I doubt that I would need that with the
 > small lens.
 >
 > Bandicoot : Yah, I've read at another place that Cokin had a magenta
 > (and also green) tint in its D filter, so I'll check that at the
 > store. I will also take a 2 stop filter. I'll check the HiTech, Singh
 > Ray and Lee.
 >
 > Thanks everybody !

I wouldn't try to use a split ND without a tripod. You want to align the
split on the ND with the transition from light to dark in the scene very
carefully (even if you use a soft split ND) if you want your photo to look
as natural as possible. I can't imagine being able to carefully compose,
slide ND up/down and press DOF preview button all at the same time! A tripod
also has the added advantage of allowing you time to compose your photos
more carefully. No accessory has the ability to improve your photography
more than a tripod.

Price versus value I would recommend HiTech ND. If money is no object then I
would buy glass ND such as from Tiffen or (I think?) Lee.

ND how to article <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.photofocus.com/zine2/zine9.htm" target="_blank">http://www.photofocus.com/zine2/zine9.htm</a>
HiTech dist. <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.visualdepartures.com/mainfram.html" target="_blank">http://www.visualdepartures.com/mainfram.html</a>
ND filters and P holders at B&H Photo (I recommend you buy here or at
Adorama)
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?A=search&Q=&a=387_3277&shs=&ci=4032&ac=&Submit.x=14&Submit.y=8" target="_blank">http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?A=search&Q=&a=387_3277...s=&ci=4</a>

Good luck,
me<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: ND filter follow up (sorry) 

On 30 Jan 2005 06:59:54 -0800, medgarevers RemoveThis @hotmail.com (michel) wrote:

 >Thanks guys, I don't know why, I'm unable to answer directly under my
 >thread. Must be mozilla ? Anyway...
 >
 >Ok, I didn't know for the plain ND filter keeping the same problem. So
 >the split ND filter will be bought. I saw in one Fitzharris book that
 >to avoid vignetting, he use duct tape to hold in place his split ND
 >filter. Anyone would recommend that if I stacked only 2 filters?. I
 >use a 72 mm dia lens. Anymodel of split ND filter superior to other
 >someone can recommend? Also, i think I'll take a medium one (force 2)
 >ND. Any advice on that too ?
 >
 >Thank you, you're very helpful.
 >
 >Michel

Hi..don't know if you read my previous on your previous (lol)
anyway...

For my two and a half cents i found the cokin holder a pain in the
butt and i was happy with my "hand held" results. If you want to
"stack" them, then i suppose the holder is a good idea. Also, if
you want to get a little creative with multiples ...or reverse
orientations, then it's useful. Cokin says you can stack them;
probably so..and you can add them up. I suppose that this means you
can throw a couple mediums together to give you more stops in the
desired frame portion. But if your not going to use a tripod...heh
heheh..why get too technical.

The yellow graduated one seems pretty cool. I must say though, other
than "exposure"..eg light/dark, i've found the color effects can
mostly all be duplicated in photo shop with overlay layers and
gradients..but that's in the digital domain.

So are you going to lock the exposure in first..then use the nd? or
are you going to let any and all sensors and meters adjust for it? ; )

Btw..no duct tape. Makes a mess. Gaffer tape. Tripod and tether would
be great. Good pan head. That's the way to go for landscapes. Lock the
mirror up if you can (so i'm told). You must have really good IS for
no tripod with your telephoto. Wide angle lens..very nice. You know
they make reducer rings.....I digress.

rgds with envy

Ken Again<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: ND filter follow up (sorry) 

Hi Ken, don't be effraid, I read all the replys I received, so nobody
is writing for nothing.

I am slowly accepting the idea of bringing a light tripod thanks to
all the good info I got here but also because I had the chance to
finally try the filter outside of the store last saturday and I saw
automaticaly how difficult it was to manage without a tripod when I
try to align "carefully" the filter. o, I really like my warming
polariser and I want to keep it. since it has no thread, I can not use
the filter holder with it. The coki polarizer are very expensve and in
resin, plus there is vignetting at 24 mm, so the holder seems a no no
to me.

So either I'll leave without a tripod and ND or I'll buy those and
I'll take them with me. I'll check how heavy the bag is and also how
many days I'll be alone with no jeep crew or other tourists rushibng
me. so far, I thik it will work it, it's just that I'm a little
unwilling to say farewell to the "mobile tourist" that I was and
becoming more a "photog". The tripod represent that "passage" to me.

For the fact that I don't have too much time to practice, well, it's a
detil, I'll take my pic as usual and the same with ND and tripod, so
it will be a learning with exciting site. and if my ND pic are soso,
well I'll still be happy with my others ones.

Ken, I think you're asking me if I have good imange stavbilisation
(IS) for my big lens ? I use a Kirk shoulder stock (very light and
effective for wildlife). aLso, what is tether and reducing ring ?

Just one more question, do I need tape with the ND filter or I can
only use hand held method with a tripod ?

Thanks to Me, Roger and all others by the way. I read you.

Ken Ellis <kenellis.DeleteThis@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message news:<i9nh01hsdi48eigjl0sso5e8jig5t0oetn.DeleteThis@4ax.com>...
 > On 30 Jan 2005 06:59:54 -0800, medgarevers.DeleteThis@hotmail.com (michel) wrote:
 >
  > >Thanks guys, I don't know why, I'm unable to answer directly under my
  > >thread. Must be mozilla ? Anyway...
  > >
  > >Ok, I didn't know for the plain ND filter keeping the same problem. So
  > >the split ND filter will be bought. I saw in one Fitzharris book that
  > >to avoid vignetting, he use duct tape to hold in place his split ND
  > >filter. Anyone would recommend that if I stacked only 2 filters?. I
  > >use a 72 mm dia lens. Anymodel of split ND filter superior to other
  > >someone can recommend? Also, i think I'll take a medium one (force 2)
  > >ND. Any advice on that too ?
  > >
  > >Thank you, you're very helpful.
  > >
  > >Michel
 >
 > Hi..don't know if you read my previous on your previous (lol)
 > anyway...
 >
 > For my two and a half cents i found the cokin holder a pain in the
 > butt and i was happy with my "hand held" results. If you want to
 > "stack" them, then i suppose the holder is a good idea. Also, if
 > you want to get a little creative with multiples ...or reverse
 > orientations, then it's useful. Cokin says you can stack them;
 > probably so..and you can add them up. I suppose that this means you
 > can throw a couple mediums together to give you more stops in the
 > desired frame portion. But if your not going to use a tripod...heh
 > heheh..why get too technical.
 >
 > The yellow graduated one seems pretty cool. I must say though, other
 > than "exposure"..eg light/dark, i've found the color effects can
 > mostly all be duplicated in photo shop with overlay layers and
 > gradients..but that's in the digital domain.
 >
 > So are you going to lock the exposure in first..then use the nd? or
 > are you going to let any and all sensors and meters adjust for it? ; )
 >
 > Btw..no duct tape. Makes a mess. Gaffer tape. Tripod and tether would
 > be great. Good pan head. That's the way to go for landscapes. Lock the
 > mirror up if you can (so i'm told). You must have really good IS for
 > no tripod with your telephoto. Wide angle lens..very nice. You know
 > they make reducer rings.....I digress.
 >
 > rgds with envy
 >
 > Ken Again<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: ND filter follow up (sorry) 

On 8 Feb 2005 19:40:42 -0800, medgarevers.DeleteThis@hotmail.com (michel) wrote:

hey...

i recently went to florida a brought a cheap aluminum $25 tripod (no
pan head obviously. It fit in my suitcase and was very light. I can
get better balance with it in creek beds on rocks..but it wont take
much to flatten it. On the other hand..the monopole is more sturdy
and i like carrying it more..cause it's more like a stick or club and
collapses down. It's easy to screw into the cam quickly sometimes
i leave it on collapsed. It's not as stable as a tripod and frankly..i
don't have alot of use for it....no swivel head...at that point i'd
just as soon stick the camera on a rock. But alot of people swear by
them and maybe i'm just not good with one.

An extra tripod is always useful. You can stick a light on it or a
second camera.

As far as the ND goes...I personally don't think you need the holder.
It is more technically correct to use one of the holder types...there
is one that goes under the camera and doesn't attach to the lens. That
said - Just hold it up flat against the lens ring by it's corner and
shoot when you have it where you want it. It works and it's fast.
Watch out how you carry them though..cause they scratch easy(resin
which i think is the new word for plastic).

If your going to only get one ND...i would suggest a fairly dark one.
I say this because, since it is graduated, by moving it you can get it
darker or lighter, so it makes more sense i think, to have the darker.
You have more range then. Also, you can turn them any which-way,
perhaps to contrast a corner; or the lower section of the frame. I
wonder what an acrylic paint would look like smeared on part of it?

I usually have my exposure locked in before i position it. You can
position it and then run your metrics. You will get two different
results.

A tether meaning a hand held shutter release. Ultimately it's nice to
try and use a tripod, lock the mirror up, and then expose with
the hand held so as to really avoid any jiggle to the camera.
Use the timer for now.

Regarding a polarizer, would you use your warming filter with it?
I don't, hmmm....anyway, you will really want a polarizer. It's not
just for the sky but also water and color depth..etc. Oh yeah, a
reducer is a ring that adapts a larger filter to a smaller lens size.

No tape. Not yet anyway. Maybe someday, but definately not
duct tape.

I'm trying to keep this simple, for my sake ; ).
rgds

Ken
 >> Stay informed about: ND filter follow up (sorry) 

Ah Ken, thank you for the explanation about the tether, I have one (I
had a very cheap tripod that I used for fireworks, the moon and the
stars but it broke and I just get rid of it a few weeks ago). Same
thing for reducer ring, I just didn't know these words in English and
the dictionnary was so far (3 feets on my right lol!)

I think I would prefer a monopod but since I already have a shoulder
stock, I'll go anyway for a tripod, more stable anyway and for holding
the filter and using tether without my tongue à la Fitzharris, there's
like no choice...

You wrote :

"there is one that goes under the camera and doesn't attach to the
lens"

Do you have a link for that or the name of that stuff so can look
about it 6

I'll get the G2 from Cokin, that's the only brand I can get in Ottawa
(and in Canada also from what I've seen, so for the moment it's gonna
do the job. How do you carry your resin filter ? I was thinking maybe
putting one or two Q-tips too immobilize it in its box (one over and
one under the filter), so it would move less and this way producing
less scratching?

Yeah, I'm trying to keep that simple and basic also. Mobility,
lightness and rapidity are important to me.

Thanks !

Ken Ellis <kenellis.RemoveThis@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message news:<cs3j01h9f16i70hsbps45cu81cnjgg7qjd.RemoveThis@4ax.com>...
 > On 8 Feb 2005 19:40:42 -0800, medgarevers.RemoveThis@hotmail.com (michel) wrote:
 >
 > hey...
 >
 > i recently went to florida a brought a cheap aluminum $25 tripod (no
 > pan head obviously. It fit in my suitcase and was very light. I can
 > get better balance with it in creek beds on rocks..but it wont take
 > much to flatten it. On the other hand..the monopole is more sturdy
 > and i like carrying it more..cause it's more like a stick or club and
 > collapses down. It's easy to screw into the cam quickly sometimes
 > i leave it on collapsed. It's not as stable as a tripod and frankly..i
 > don't have alot of use for it....no swivel head...at that point i'd
 > just as soon stick the camera on a rock. But alot of people swear by
 > them and maybe i'm just not good with one.
 >
 > An extra tripod is always useful. You can stick a light on it or a
 > second camera.
 >
 > As far as the ND goes...I personally don't think you need the holder.
 > It is more technically correct to use one of the holder types...there
 > is one that goes under the camera and doesn't attach to the lens. That
 > said - Just hold it up flat against the lens ring by it's corner and
 > shoot when you have it where you want it. It works and it's fast.
 > Watch out how you carry them though..cause they scratch easy(resin
 > which i think is the new word for plastic).
 >
 > If your going to only get one ND...i would suggest a fairly dark one.
 > I say this because, since it is graduated, by moving it you can get it
 > darker or lighter, so it makes more sense i think, to have the darker.
 > You have more range then. Also, you can turn them any which-way,
 > perhaps to contrast a corner; or the lower section of the frame. I
 > wonder what an acrylic paint would look like smeared on part of it?
 >
 > I usually have my exposure locked in before i position it. You can
 > position it and then run your metrics. You will get two different
 > results.
 >
 > A tether meaning a hand held shutter release. Ultimately it's nice to
 > try and use a tripod, lock the mirror up, and then expose with
 > the hand held so as to really avoid any jiggle to the camera.
 > Use the timer for now.
 >
 > Regarding a polarizer, would you use your warming filter with it?
 > I don't, hmmm....anyway, you will really want a polarizer. It's not
 > just for the sky but also water and color depth..etc. Oh yeah, a
 > reducer is a ring that adapts a larger filter to a smaller lens size.
 >
 > No tape. Not yet anyway. Maybe someday, but definately not
 > duct tape.
 >
 > I'm trying to keep this simple, for my sake ; ).
 > rgds
 >
 > Ken<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: ND filter follow up (sorry) 

On 9 Feb 2005 04:13:47 -0800, medgarevers.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com (michel) wrote:


 >
 >"there is one that goes under the camera and doesn't attach to the
 >lens"
 >
 >Do you have a link for that or the name of that stuff so can look
 >about it 6

sorry, nope..search around on the net, you'll find them. I didn't keep
the links.


 >I'll get the G2 from Cokin, that's the only brand I can get in Ottawa
 >(and in Canada also from what I've seen, so for the moment it's gonna
 >do the job. How do you carry your resin filter ? I was thinking maybe
 >putting one or two Q-tips too immobilize it in its box (one over and
 >one under the filter), so it would move less and this way producing
 >less scratching?

it's ok in the closed box.. it's when you leave the box open and carry
it around and the plastic rubs on the edge of the edge of the bottom.
I had mine in a fanny pack and the top off and climbing around it
got pushed around. If it were closed it would have been no problem.
That's all..it's fine in the closed case. Save the q'tips for your
ears @">

Ken<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: ND filter follow up (sorry) 

Save the q'tips for your ears @">

Yes, 2 Q tips less, it's gonna be lighter

Thanks !

Ken Ellis <kenellis.DeleteThis@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message news:<kigl01l8dp5gcona2ftegper186dr0iobq.DeleteThis@4ax.com>...
 > On 9 Feb 2005 04:13:47 -0800, medgarevers.DeleteThis@hotmail.com (michel) wrote:
 >
 >
  > >
  > >"there is one that goes under the camera and doesn't attach to the
  > >lens"
  > >
  > >Do you have a link for that or the name of that stuff so can look
  > >about it 6
 >
 > sorry, nope..search around on the net, you'll find them. I didn't keep
 > the links.
 >
 >
  > >I'll get the G2 from Cokin, that's the only brand I can get in Ottawa
  > >(and in Canada also from what I've seen, so for the moment it's gonna
  > >do the job. How do you carry your resin filter ? I was thinking maybe
  > >putting one or two Q-tips too immobilize it in its box (one over and
  > >one under the filter), so it would move less and this way producing
  > >less scratching?
 >
 > it's ok in the closed box.. it's when you leave the box open and carry
 > it around and the plastic rubs on the edge of the edge of the bottom.
 > I had mine in a fanny pack and the top off and climbing around it
 > got pushed around. If it were closed it would have been no problem.
 > That's all..it's fine in the closed case. Save the q'tips for your
 > ears @">
 >
 > Ken<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: ND filter follow up (sorry)