Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up

 >Even if it is an overseas product, shouldn't they still be familiar with it?



You would think so. <!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

This question has popped-up a few times recently in this newsgroup. I spoke to
Kodak a few months ago, and here's what they had to say... The Royal Supra name
is not going to be used here in the U.S. The same emulsions will be named High
Definition, and possibly a few other countries. Therefore, Royal Supra and High
Definition are the same films. The last version of Royal Gold 400 (the boxes
with the gold emblem stating "Sharpest 400 film...." was in reality the new
Royal Supra/High Definition emulsion. These were only available for a few
months before Kodak changed the name in the U.S. to High Definition. As for the
200 ISO Royal Gold, look for Kodak to also change the name to High Definition
shortly. I'm not certain, but the current Royal Gold 200 may already be the new
emulsion.
 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

The Dave© wrote:
  >>We are somewhat unfamiliar with KODAK ROYAL
  >>SUPRA Film here in the United States, .......
 >
 >
 > Even if it is an overseas product, shouldn't they still be familiar with it?
 >
 >

I would have thought so..... Maybe Kodak isn't Kodak.

Bob<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

On Tue, 24 Jun 2003 13:20:50 -0700, mf06d.RemoveThis@aol.com wrote:

 >We are somewhat unfamiliar with KODAK ROYAL SUPRA Film here in the
 >United States, but I believe it would be equivalent of KODAK ROYAL GOLD
 >200 Film. You also asked what the difference would be between KODAK
 >ROYAL GOLD 400 Film and KODAK High Definition Film (ISO 400). This is
 >an easy question to answer, because they are one and the same product.
 >High Definition Film is the new name for ROYAL GOLD 400 Film.

I got a different answer when I asked Kodak about the difference between
High Definition 400 and Royal Supra 400:

First of all, let me confirm that ROYAL SUPRA 400 is not the same thing
as High Definition 400. It is similar, but not quite the same - there
is a shared technology between the two films. However, ROYAL SUPRA 400
IS EXACTLY the same thing as KODAK PROFESSIONAL PORTRA 400UC Film,
available here in the US (same product, different name for different
region).

Given that they clearly sell Portra 400UC worldwide, right alongside
Royal Supra, this answer makes no sense. I suspect we're not about to
get a straight answer from Kodak on this.

Ted


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 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

I read these sort of exchanges and I realize that there must be
complete disarray within Kodak presently. To have so disjointed a
vision of their market and product as to desperately be flailing away
at something so basic as product line continuity. It's a sure sign
that the hand-wringing bean counters have taken over and the true
product people have been thinned to the bone.....


On Fri, 27 Jun 2003 19:57:49 -0700, No Spam Please <nospam RemoveThis @see.my.sig>
wrote:

 >On Tue, 24 Jun 2003 13:20:50 -0700, mf06d RemoveThis @aol.com wrote:
 >
  >>We are somewhat unfamiliar with KODAK ROYAL SUPRA Film here in the
  >>United States, but I believe it would be equivalent of KODAK ROYAL GOLD
  >>200 Film. You also asked what the difference would be between KODAK
  >>ROYAL GOLD 400 Film and KODAK High Definition Film (ISO 400). This is
  >>an easy question to answer, because they are one and the same product.
  >>High Definition Film is the new name for ROYAL GOLD 400 Film.
 >
 >I got a different answer when I asked Kodak about the difference between
 >High Definition 400 and Royal Supra 400:
 >
 >First of all, let me confirm that ROYAL SUPRA 400 is not the same thing
 >as High Definition 400. It is similar, but not quite the same - there
 >is a shared technology between the two films. However, ROYAL SUPRA 400
 >IS EXACTLY the same thing as KODAK PROFESSIONAL PORTRA 400UC Film,
 >available here in the US (same product, different name for different
 >region).
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

On Sat, 28 Jun 2003 03:20:35 -0700, Craig Schroeder wrote:
 >I read these sort of exchanges and I realize that there must be
 >complete disarray within Kodak presently. To have so disjointed a
 >vision of their market and product as to desperately be flailing away
 >at something so basic as product line continuity. It's a sure sign
 >that the hand-wringing bean counters have taken over and the true
 >product people have been thinned to the bone.....

It would seem to be the disarray of a company in dire financial straits,
perhaps due to mismanagement and certainly exacerbated by the economic
recession. Another section of the e-mail I got from Kodak all but admits
to this (in replying to my question about why High Definition 400 isn't
available in 36-exposure rolls):

"[W]e are experiencing tough economic pressures at this time and as a
way of managing costs and inventories, the slow-moving products and
sizes of certain products (such as the 36-exposure rolls of consumer
films) had to be eliminated. We are sorry for any inconvenience this may
cause but we feel it is necessary in order to cope with these economic
pressures until the economy improves once again. We no longer have the
luxury to offer the extremely wide varieties we once used to have but we
still intend to meet consumer demands with a streamlined product
portfolio and size/quantity offering."

Long before they thinned out the "true product people," they surely cut
the customer service staff (who are "outside the value stream," to use
the bean counters' terminology). So it's not surprising that the bean
counters don't make a priority of providing accurate information to
those who are left to answer e-mails.

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 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

U¿ytkownik "No Spam Please" <nospam RemoveThis @see.my.sig> napisa³ w wiadomo¶ci
news:2003627195749.310314@tm1003087...
On Tue, 24 Jun 2003 13:20:50 -0700, mf06d RemoveThis @aol.com wrote:

 > First of all, let me confirm that ROYAL SUPRA 400 is not the same thing
 > as High Definition 400. It is similar, but not quite the same - there
 > is a shared technology between the two films. However, ROYAL SUPRA 400
 > IS EXACTLY the same thing as KODAK PROFESSIONAL PORTRA 400UC Film,
 > available here in the US (same product, different name for different
 > region).

Somebody must be kidding. I have shot plenty of Royal Supra's 400 and one roll of Portra
400 UC and definitely they're not the same, moreover Portra is twice the price of Royal
Supra here in Poland. They are not the same for 100%.

 > Given that they clearly sell Portra 400UC worldwide, right alongside
 > Royal Supra, this answer makes no sense. I suspect we're not about to

Exactly.

Regards,
KZ<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

In article <2003627195749.310314@tm1003087>,
No Spam Please <nospam.DeleteThis@see.my.sig> wrote:
 >However, ROYAL SUPRA 400
 >IS EXACTLY the same thing as KODAK PROFESSIONAL PORTRA 400UC Film,
 >available here in the US (same product, different name for different
 >region).
 >
 >Given that they clearly sell Portra 400UC worldwide, right alongside
 >Royal Supra, this answer makes no sense. I suspect we're not about to
 >get a straight answer from Kodak on this.

Isn't that sort of like Fuji selling the film with the
code "CZ" under the name "Press 800" if it's a 36-exposure
roll in a camera store and "Superia X-Tra 800" if it's a
24-exposure roll in a drug store or grocery?

I can think of several people I know who would blink and
pause if faced with a product named "Portra 400UC" (never
mind the "Professional" part of the name) but who would
react to "Royal Supra 400" with a gut feel of, "Oh, that
must mean fancy-special-good". (Note that these are
intelligent people, just insecure when out of their field,
especially when the names of films look as though they
ought to mean (uh, "explicitly signify") more than they do.)

OTOH, if I hadn't found out that it's the same thing as
Portra 400UC, my gut reaction of the name "Royal Supra 400"
would be, "Oh, that sounds like fancymarketingspeak to
impress drug store consumers. I don't know what it is, but
it's probably not what I want." (Now I know better -- it
_usually_ won't be what I want, but sometimes it'll be
exactly what I want.)

Different intended audiences; different marketing. The
name is part of the marketing.

Goya is a manufacturer of Hispanic foods for the US market
(mainly East Coast, IIRC, but I don't spend enough time
away from the East Coast to notice whether they're big in
other parts of the country or not). They sell identical
products under one name for neighbourhoods with lots of
Puerto Rican immigrants, another name for neighbourhoods
with lots of Mexian immigrants, yet another for neighbourhoods
with mostly Venezuelan immigrants, and so on, depending on
what that food is called in each country. Apparently
the increase in sales based on name familiarity is greater
than the expense of maintaining several label designs for
each product and keeping track of regional demographics.

--
D. Glenn Arthur Jr./The Human Vibrator, dglenn.DeleteThis@radix.net
Due to hand/wrist problems my newsreading time varies so I may miss followups.
"Being a _man_ means knowing that one has a choice not to act like a 'man'."
Glenn's page<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

If Kodak is really concerned about sharpness, why don't they bring
back Ektar/Royal Gold 25? That film was amazing, the sharpness was
limited only by the resolving power of the lens.
 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

In article <267766ad.0306300752.700083f0 DeleteThis @posting.google.com> AlanRRT DeleteThis @aol.com (Alan) writes:
$If Kodak is really concerned about sharpness, why don't they bring
$back Ektar/Royal Gold 25? That film was amazing, the sharpness was
$limited only by the resolving power of the lens.

Kodak is a business. Their goal is simple, and very much like the
goal of most other businesses: make a profit. If making an amazingly
sharp 25-speed film is such a good way of making a profit, surely
Fuji and Konica and Agfa and Kodak and Ferrania and whoever else makes
film these days would be doing it. Apparently, either all of those
companies don't know much about the film market, or they've all
noticed there isn't much of a market for 25-speed films.

There is, however, a huge market for 400-speed films, and some
people in that market would be amenable to paying a higher price
for an even sharper 400 film. If they simply wanted a sharper film,
regardless of speed, they'd already have ditched Gold Max Versatility
Ultra Zoom Whatever They're Calling It This Week 400 and
started using Gold Bright Sun Whatever It's Called This Week 100; it's
sharper and finer-grained.
--
Stephen M. Dunn <stephen DeleteThis @stevedunn.ca>
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 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

I'd have to agree with you on this one. Kodak is probably second only
to Disney in marketing savvy. Not that that's necessarily a bad
thing, but the consumer needs to be careful to know what they're
getting. I know that I would buy a very sharp 25 speed film. And
yes, I recognize that I'm in the minority. Using the sunny 16 rule, a
25 speed film can be used at 125 and f:8, quite a handholdable speed,
and an aperature found on any lens other than a P/S zoom at the wide
end. Anyway, my point was that I miss Ektar 25. And I haven't
changed my mind on that.

stephen DeleteThis @stevedunn.ca (Stephen M. Dunn) wrote in message news:<HHBA5q.24o DeleteThis @stevedunn.ca>...
 > In article <267766ad.0306300752.700083f0 DeleteThis @posting.google.com> AlanRRT DeleteThis @aol.com (Alan) writes:
 > $If Kodak is really concerned about sharpness, why don't they bring
 > $back Ektar/Royal Gold 25? That film was amazing, the sharpness was
 > $limited only by the resolving power of the lens.
 >
 > Kodak is a business. Their goal is simple, and very much like the
 > goal of most other businesses: make a profit. If making an amazingly
 > sharp 25-speed film is such a good way of making a profit, surely
 > Fuji and Konica and Agfa and Kodak and Ferrania and whoever else makes
 > film these days would be doing it. Apparently, either all of those
 > companies don't know much about the film market, or they've all
 > noticed there isn't much of a market for 25-speed films.
 >
 > There is, however, a huge market for 400-speed films, and some
 > people in that market would be amenable to paying a higher price
 > for an even sharper 400 film. If they simply wanted a sharper film,
 > regardless of speed, they'd already have ditched Gold Max Versatility
 > Ultra Zoom Whatever They're Calling It This Week 400 and
 > started using Gold Bright Sun Whatever It's Called This Week 100; it's
 > sharper and finer-grained.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

AlanRRT DeleteThis @aol.com (Alan) wrote in message news:<267766ad.0306302139.2748e3ad DeleteThis @posting.google.com>...
an aperature found on any lens other than a P/S zoom at the wide
 > end

Ooops, make that the long end.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up 

probably because most zoom lenses that people are using are too slow for
that speed of film

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"Alan" <AlanRRT.RemoveThis@aol.com> wrote in message
news:267766ad.0306300752.700083f0@posting.google.com...
 > If Kodak is really concerned about sharpness, why don't they bring
 > back Ektar/Royal Gold 25? That film was amazing, the sharpness was
 > limited only by the resolving power of the lens.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: Royal Supra and High Defenition Cleared Up